CNN’s Fareed Zakaria importantly talks about the problem with our two-party system but he overlooks the bigger reason the United States has been stuck with only two parties for so long. Very restrictive ballot access laws are only a minor hurdle to viable third parties. The much bigger problem is our first-past-the-post election system. From Zakaria:
One of you asked me: Why there aren’t more serious third party candidates in the United States?
One very simple reason is the two parties have effectively created a duopoly. It is very, very difficult to get on the ballot in any state. There’s a group called Americans Elect 2012 that has been trying to create a third party platform just to get on the ballot. And it takes hundreds of thousands of signatures – over a million in California – to do it. It’s a scandal, really, because democracy should be about giving people alternatives and allowing peoples’ voices to be heard. But the two parties collude to make sure that you don’t get a third party.
The second piece of it is America just does not have a very broad ideological spectrum. If you look at America’s two parties, they’re actually very close together in terms of their ideological differences. Both American parties – the Democrats and the Republicans – would fit comfortably as center-right parties in Europe. You have no real social democratic party. You have no real hyper-nationalist parties. If you look at the width of the European political spectrum, the United States occupies a kind of narrow position on it. So it makes sense that we don’t have ten competitive parties.
I most disagree with Zakaria that we, as a country, lack the political spectrum of Europe. I believe he is falsely assuming the effect is the cause. The election laws are what reduce the number of viable political parties, not the narrowness of actual American opinions.
There are many Americans with highly divergent political views. The problem is that our election system makes it impossible for smaller parties to win any power.
Ron Paul is a good example. His relatively strong showing in the GOP primary shows that there is roughly 10 percent of the country that agrees with him. If we used proportional representation, like most European countries, Ron Paul would likely be the head of his own party. They would win 10 percent of the vote and as a result get roughly 10 percent of the seats in Congress. His party would be a minor but consistently important force in politics. They would often shape legislation.
Under our system, though, if Paul created his own party and it got 10% of the vote, it would lose the presidency and likely not win a single seat in Congress. Worse, by serving as a “spoiler” it would likely throw power to the other party the members least agree with. Since we use the first-past-the-post system, their running and doing relatively well would perversely serve to hinder their actual legislative objectives.
It is neither the lack of desire for more parties or the lack of ideological diversity that explains the limited numbers of political parties in the United States. The reason there are only two parties is that they’ve written all our election laws to make it nearly impossible for there ever to be more than two viable parties.



41 Comments
Manipulating the proportionality system in Germany is how Hitler got into power. Never got more than 30-something% of the vote.
So that system has its minuses too.
Democracy (people power) was originally conceived of give the populace the power to decide major issues concerning their welfare and governance. But we elected officials (whom we trusted) and they betrayed our trust and only modified the system to guarantee the own jobs and lucrative pay scales in perpetuity, no matter what “we the people” might have to say about it. “They” are untruthful, unreliable and unrelenting in their quest for job security. Shame on them for such despicable behavior and shame on us for continuing to let them get away with it.
Could we, for just once ,please, NOT play the Nazi card?????
OK, so let’s take examples from countries that have a lot of little parties, all of which pass the test for how big they have to be to get reps, complicated coalitions must be formed, a nearly impossible task, and teh country becomes ungovernable.
I don’t know those situations so well; chose Germany bc it is such an obvious example of the downside of proportionality.
Lany Guinier (remember her) drove the pols nuts when Clinton put her up for some cabinet post bc her research was on the pros & cons of alternative voting systems. I never read any further bc she got rejected, and it’s clear the U.S. isn’t going down any of the alternative paths.
Shocking. Pennsylvania is the lastest state to pass legislation intended to disenfranchise voters, even in the restricted two-party system.
The bill.
The vote..
The real reason we have had our two-party system so long is well known to political theorists.
Two is the ideal number of political parties to have in a manipulated system purporting to be a democracy.
If there were any more than two parties, the necessary greasing of political wheels would be more expensive with less control over outcomes. If there were any less than two parties, people would have a better idea of what has really been happening all along.
They don’t need voters. They have power & money.
Winnah!
It’s why the pols went nuts when Clinton put Guinier up for office. Can’t have any of those less controllable voting systems.
My senator is Dominic Pileggi, a Villanova grad like me. Apologies to HIVNAH, but Pileggi from the high-brow Main Line is clearly following the playbook of the low-brow clique you refer to in #1.
2 is the smallest number larger than 1, in other words.
The US has evolved a two-party duopoly because the Congress is not structured as a Parliamentary system and because until 1968, both parties were big tent parties that embraced a variety of ideologies. US parties functioned until 1968 like European coalitions. The Republican modern conservative purge and the increasing importance of the media war in campaigns moved the system to an ideological duopoly, with neo-conservative (foreign relations) neoliberalism (domestic policy) being the ideology.
First-past-the-post ensures the continuation of the duopoly but it is only one factor.
What would shake things up would be more third and fourth party local and state candidates who can muster a winning following and build national parties. Why is it that the Greens, for example, have not taken local governments and built geographical bases to take state government? (not to pick on the Greens but it also goes for Socialists of various stripes as well) All of the efforts have been candidate-centered, not party-building.
What I have seen over and over again on the left is (1) late starts in the cycle, (2) candidate-centered efforts that collapse if (when) the candidate loses, (3) wanting to win as a minority in a majority-wins election, (4) failure to make the effort to persuade voters over a long period of time of the value of your political position.
What I saw the Republicans do in the South between 1958 (when politics began crashing into public schools) and 1980 is (1) keep the message going over and over — “Liberals only want to be liberal with YOUR tax money.” “Soft on communism”…you know the shtick. After a while my parents acquaintance began parroting this narrative. And then you had a high-profile Southern Democrat (Strom Thurmond) change parties. And lesser politicians whose ambitions had been blocked by the Democratic establishment joined him in running downticket. And they lost. In 1980, they brought a lot of “Reagan Democrats” to split their ticket. In 1994, the got those same folks to vote the Republican ticket and declare their registration as Republicans. Thirty-six years of hard political work, even with the help of the PtB who decided that Republicans would serve their interest in the South better than Democrats.
It’s about time to realize that there are no gimmicks to getting alternatives going.
And check out just how powerful those minority parties in governing coalitions turn out to be in practice. The duopoly of the PtB exists there as well but exerted through the coalitions of the moment.
Damn! There’s no ‘Recommend’ button for mere comments :-(
What two party system, in which country is that pundidiot tool, Zakaria of the PTB referring to? Surely not USA,Inc.
The second piece of it is America just does not have a very broad ideological spectrum. If you look at America’s two parties, they’re actually very close together in terms of their ideological differences.
The two parties are very close because they are both owned by corporations and those that run them. They merely serve the purpose of channeling the same corporatist agenda.
I actually think that we will see the day when we have two new major parties. I think that eventually we will have a leftist party, a right-center combination of old GOP moderates and DINOs, and the far right winger party.
However, the creation and emergence of that leftist party is going to be a long, bloody, violent process, with the duopoly parties conspiring in every way possible to kill it. I think the process will start in a couple of medium-sized states, where the costs of scale are not as enormous as they are in CA, TX, FL, NY, NJ, PA, etc. Just making a wild-ass guess, I’d bet that such a party would make its first inroads in states like MN, OR, MI, WI, etc. Once that party started to elect a few state legislators and Congresscritters, its viability would be demonstrated and after that, it’s Katie-bar-the-door.
And no, I’m not referring to the Green Party, which is an unserious playtoy for dilettantes who have no real interest in governing, or clue how to do so.
Let’s not EVER neglect the simplest truth, that our electorate comprises fools at all levels, and plenty of them.
In the 1980 campaign and election, John Anderson ran without any party affiliation. No one at that time could register as ‘Independent’, that so-called political category didn’t exist in law until later.
So what, the media still referred to Anderson as “a third-party candidate”, even though other candidates, with party affiliation (Socialist, Communist) were 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc. party candidates, while Anderson was a no-party candidate.
But how about having multiple parties run for President? If we had a multipy party system for President he winner would get like 35% of the vote. I guess there would have to be 2 rounds of voting. One with all the candidates and a second election between the top 2 candidates.
You can also do instant runoff.
There are all kinds of different voting schemes, every one of which has pluses and minuses. As I said above, I didn’t bother reading about them bc it would be a waste of time as none of them will come into being in the U.S.
The abiding fail is that the pols serve much too long before they stand for election again. Our system can work with only two parties, but the terms of office ought to expire in six months. If that doesn’t work to effect a nice mix of the spectrum, reduce it to six weeks. The old saw about experience in office being necessary doesn’t cut it anymore since there’s Wikipedia, Google, and all those social networks. *g*/s/:-)/:-(
Zakaria doesn’t know what he’s talking about. There are plenty of small parties on the ballots in California (Libertarian, Green, Natural Law, Peace and Freedom and whatever else).
What I learned in Political Science class is what makes sense: Our system of winner-takes-all on a district-by-district basis, instead of proportional representation, strongly favors a two-party system.
Kill-joy.
Good post. I’ll recommend it if I can figure out how to do that.
Nope. The House of Representatives would decide.
Check out the election of 1824 (John Quincy Adams). One party (Democratic-Republican). Four major candidates, unpledged electors, and other candidates (local favorite sons). John Quincy Adams got 30.92% of the popular vote and 32.2% of the electoral vote (unpledged electors were “anybody but Jackson”). Went to the House of Representatives, where after lots of dickering he came out with 54.2% of the vote.
It’s already on the FDL front page, which the ‘recommend’ feature is supposed to help make happen if the post blog is at MyFDL, for example.
Correct, the problem is winner-take-all, and that in turn is what causes the two major parties to look alike, and also results in 38% of the electorate not voting (last time) in the presidential.
Actually they (we) did vote: None of the above.
The power base for Presidential elections is built over time out of the results of local, state, and Congressional elections. Winner-take-all in a district favor two parties that have continuity over district elections. New parties can enter and over time become one of those two parties. For that to cover more than one district, typically there is an interest group that crosses districts. Eugene Debs benefitted from a network of workingmen’s associations and local Socialist parties, for example. Those interest groups spanned multiple districts. And had power in those districts.
But there is nothing about the first-past-the-post system that prevents new parties from taking a mayor and city council in a city, performing well enough to gain support in nearby communities and…
I don’t believe proportional representation had ANYTHING to do with Hitlers rise to power! 1. Hitler got about a third of the vote. 2. Hitler was appointed Chancellor by the German President Hindenburg which he, as most parliamentary Presidents, had the Constitutional power, but not the requirement, to do. 3. Then Hitler basically used intimidation and extra legal violence to become dictator.
The majority of the worlds democracies use some form of proportional representation in at least one legislative house.
The case for proportional representation is fundamentally the same as that for representative democracy. Only if an assembly represents the full diversity of opinion within a nation can its decisions be regarded as the decisions of the nation itself.
Attribution: Encyclopedia Britannica
This Jon Walker guy is obviously dangerous and evil. Everybody knows that promoting more democratic government leads to NAZI Germanys and HOLOCAUSTS!!!
But don’t worry, even Jon Walker cannot change the sacred immutable US political system as changing that would be like adding 1 and 1 and getting 3!
No doubt when the Sun expands into a red giant billions of years in the future, the wonders of the US political system will be exactly the same as it is now!
I do not disagree with the many people pointing out how limited our democracy is in the U.S. – HOWEVER: Education is much more powerful than expressing personal opinions.
PLEASE stop expressing personal opinions based on experience, and start providing some actual laws with some documentation for credibility. Education is much more powerful than expressing personal opinions.
Some basic starting material –
Reference article:
What is a Political Party?
http://i-voter.tripod.com/US_PoliticalParties.html
Reference article:
Our Glorious National Committees: Ever wonder what they do?
http://i-voter.tripod.com/NationalCommittees.html
Reference article:
The Filibuster: More Apparent than Real
http://i-voter.tripod.com/SenateFillibuster.html
Those who do nothing but opine are pathetic
Verb:
Hold and state as one’s opinion: ““The man is a genius,” he opined”.
Thank you, Jon.
This post and the comments which it has elicited are very much appreciated and very necessary to understanding how “things”, politically have come to be as they “are”, in this nation and this society, and how those “things” might, reasonably, be changed … for the better.
Among the questions such “change” shall necessitate are, first, by what “means” and, second, what shall citizens be required to “do” that those means may be realized …? Other questions will follow, especially this one: If such change may be brought into meaningful being, then how might such a changed political “system” be maintained and even expanded to a fully participatory, rather than simply a more honest “representative”, form?
I hope that you might consider doing further posts on those means … and those responsibilities that shall be and must be the “lot”, the necessarily responsible endeavor of citizens …
DW
I have to stick with what I am good at. Apparently there is a lot of stuff that Ecahn doesn”t bother to read because it is beneath him. I guess it helps him be able to sing better from the same old songbooks.
Actually, HIVANH, eCAHN, is a she … and very well-read. She happens to be quite a student of Howard Zinn, BTW, and she is not particularly, shall we say, “optimistic” in the “short run” that “things” will much improve. As her moniker implies, she is quite well-versed on issues economic, she is possessed of a well-calibrated moral compass and given to VERY careful and thorough study of those many things which interest her, a trait, you will find that she shares with many on these threads. At times, she is rather taciturn and never given to loquacious palaver …
If you care to open your mind, then eCAHN, is someone from whom you might learn more than a little, however, like Margaret who is a science and technology whiz, among other things, eCAHN does not suffer fools gladly, indeed, not at all, truth to tell, and is not given to foolish or poorly considered pronouncements.
She has been “here” for a long time and is very well respected, for the soundness of her insights and the sharp edge to which she often hones her humor … which facts may not much impress you, and eCAHN sings, by the way, not from “old songbooks”, but from a broad and varied perspective … and, rather than slugging it out with those who seek, for whatever reasons, to disagreeably disagree with her, she simply leaves to pursue other, more useful, endeavors.
You may find that YMMV, and time will tell how you come to be perceived on these threads and within this community, HIVANH.
I wish you well.
DW
Stop the B.S. When there is a parallel to something that happened in Germany in the 30′s to what is happening in the U.S. NOW, then there is no reason not to point it out. You and your ilk are responsible for ignoring what has happened in a HISTORICAL context and the equating of that context to what is happening now. Because you refuse to acknowledge that historical context I label you TROLL. Shut up and crawl back under your bridge where you can hide your head in the sand, sing “la, la, la” and ignore what is happening around you. People with your attitude really piss me off.
Actually, proportional representation did have a profound effect on the ascent of the Nazi party. Without that “foot in the door” there would have been no National Socialist Workers Party with any power to even put an Adolph Hitler in position to be appointed Chancellor.
In fact, that is the only way that a 3rd party can gain any power in a representative democracy. I’ve been arguing this point for months, and getting creamed for it by the “True Progressives”.
I know that we sometimes disagree, but your analysis is worth reading multiple times. Kudos.
In case you missed it, comrade reddog, eCAHN’s post was about a non-parallel. Is it allowable to request the NAZI card not be played then?
Or must you always play it?
Sometimes I feel like a pinball smacked around by the eCAHN flippers.
Don’t you know all issues are intricately related to NAZI Germany, Hitler and the holocaust. Germans drank beer, thus if you see beer the fascist state which will be uncannily be an exact replica of Nazi Germany is nigh!
If memory serves me, she seems to sow a lot of status quo promoting FUD (Fear Uncertainty Doubt). In in this case, it seems contrary to Jon Walker’s message.
And this was a beaut:
I would think this, but I never say it out loud in a forum, especially in response to a Jon Walker article.
Read William Shirer’s Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. Proportional representation slowed Hitler’s rise to power. Even though the National Socialist Party was the biggest party, it didn’t get a majority so it couldn’t get a majority in parliament. In a “winner take all” system, the National Socialists would have achieved power sooner.
The Center Party voted with the National Socialists and that is the only way the National Socialists were able to take power. The Center Party was a party that mostly represented Catholics.